18det MODS

[drudedon]

Alright ,my question is this: What mods do I have to do to a ca18det before boosting up to 18-20 psi. The reason I'm asking this is because of this quote(this is a quote by JIMI) "Your point on internals strength is also taken, however speaking from experience my friends CA18DET blew the bottom end on 14psi, and i know people with SR20DE's (yes, non turbo engines) that have 10psi jammed into them with no problems (8,000km's!)." I don't want this shit to happen to me. This is my plan: gt25, supra or starion intercooler, reprogramed ecu, bov, possibly an external waste gate, and a hks head gasket over 1mm thick(to lower compression). Not installing my 18det till I do my mods.

[Akela]

Forged pistons is obviously the safest thing you can do to run high boost. But u may be able to get away with this with good tuning through the computer. Also you'll need bigger injectors, fuel pump. Full exhaust?

[drudedon]

Forged pistons, way to much money for me. Unless you know were I could get some at a reasonable price. I'm going to get 3" mandrell bent all the way through or split towards the end and get two 2.5". What injectors and fuel pump can I use(GTIR, rb, aftermarket, etc..)?

[Akela]

1200 aus dollars for forged pistons. I'd sujest a set of new Bosch aftermarket injectors. I'd use a fuel pump from an EA ford falcon. Its a 4L 6 cylkinder, so it does a good job.

[boost_boy]

But u may be able to get away with this with good tuning through the computer. Also you'll need bigger injectors, fuel pump. Full exhaust? Couldn't have said this better myself! The stock CA18DET can take 400hp worth of abuse and running around on 15-20psi everyday won't kill it if you have a suitable host of parts to feed and support it. At least 550cc injectors, a decently programmed ecu or aftermarket unit (I use an www.sdsefi.com) and a nice turbo (I used a T3/T04B stage 1 and produced over 312 whp@18psi). I also drove the car everyday on 15psi (Very hard). Your friend that blew his bottom end either had a crappy motor from the start pr he was detonating (I bet he had the stock turbo) and didn't pay attention to it.

[drudedon]

is it better to go with an electric fuel pump and how much gph or psi is recommended.

[boostinhard]

Hey,
you dont have to spend a fortune - just spend it in the right places. I'd recomend an aftermarket computer as your major outlay, its worth every penny trust me. As for the fuel side of things, you can get second hand VL turbo pumps for like $60-$80 which should do the job. Second hand injectors can be picked up, and say a set of four FJ20 turbo injectors which flow in the 500cc area for $200 is not hard to come by. With an aftermarket computer, forged pistons are not required s you should be able to elinate all detonation with a good tune, (seeing that a aftermarket comp is around the same price as a set of forgies - and one rules out the other plus offers many more features - it just makes sense to me). Plus call a place called "Ridgecrest" on (03) 5981 4334 for incredibly high quality copper headgaskets in any thickness for a fraction of the price of a HKS unit (around $110, you'll get it in a few days, its re-useable and it can take much more force than the standard gasket!) - incase you cant tell - I love copper headgaskets!!! lol
Please dont get me wong, forgies are awesome, just suitably priced and not required in the search for substantional power outputs.
I'd personally lok at buying a second motor and building it up over time as the money comes in. Strip it down, give it a full rebuild with some new ACL pisotns, possibly some ARP bottom end nuts and bolts, if you can, get the block o-ringed whe nyou get it honed (goes really well with the copper headgasket) give the head a reco, buy a nice second hand cooler and get it all tuned by teh best dyno tuner in your area. Tell them the boost you wann run and they'll see how high it can go safely.
Do as much work yourself as you can, get as many second hand parts as you can and dont be affraid to spend the money in the right area! Good luck!
Sam

[Akela]

Hey man, just top let you know, turbo fj20 injectors are almost the same as standard ca18det injectors. I know i was using a set and sold them cause i bought a RWD silvia engine which had a sligjhtly newer set but exactly the same. But what all these guys say here are very true. Chris's ET (2nd Fastest in AUs) runs NA pistons and i am planning on using ACL CA20 NA pistons on my DET.

[boost_boy]

Hey boostinhard,

I just recently acquired a ridgecrest copper gasket that is 2mm and am wondering do you use this gasket. I'm debating should I use it or use my NISMO 1.2mm metal gasket. I was trying to prevent o-ringing, but that's why I'm asking your opinion. Do the people that have used the copper gasket have success and do they o-ring both the block and head? I'm interested to know your take on these ???s.

[boostinhard]

Hey,
I wouldnt believe that about his pistons... that was a rumor that not even he knew the answer too. Turbo pistons are made out of different compunds than NA pistons to handle the different heat/pressure in a turbo engine.
Plus FJ injectors are 550cc, CA18DET injectors are 380cc, thats 145% bigger - large enough for most upgrades. Any larger and you will loose resolution in the lower reigions...
Sam

[boostinhard]

Hey,
yes I use the e15et version of that 2mm copper headgasket. I have an o-ringed block only and it works an absolute charm. You an use teh copper head gasket without o-ringing, but it really comes into its own when matched with o-rings. I'd only suggest o-ringing both the block and the head if your planning on running some really serious compression/boost or if your using an VERY thick copper gasket to reduce compression. I believe the metal headgaskets are made to work without o-rings - but cant say I know that much about them to be honest. If you have one, then by all means give it a shot, cant go wrong. I have great faith in the ridgcrest gasket and an o-ringed block - and Im sure you would be too!
Sam

[boost_boy]

Thanks man! I will be running up to 30psi of boost in an attempt to achieve that 500whp from a fwd nissan sentra with CA18DET. My sig supports my other goal:) One more question, did you use any type of solution between the head and gasket? I'm going to use the gasket! Hell, I paid $$$ for it and I'm kinda worried about that NISMO gasket holding together while I wind the boost waaay up.

[boostinhard]

Hey,
30psi!!! Sheesh! in that case, you'll want the 2mm thick copper gasket with both the head and the block o-ringed, well atleast one or the other - but preferably both. You can buy this stuff thats made for copper headgaskets - its a spray can that you coat the gasket in. Make sure that the gasket is anealed (should come like this, but you'll need to do it every time you want to re-use it) which is simply heating it up on a flame till it gets white hot all over. this makes it all soft again, ready to be compacted up inbetween your head and your block! ;) happy boosting!
sam

[boost_boy]

Thanks for the info, Sam! I'm going to go and get the head/block o-ringed since the block has already been decked. I think 500whp won't be a problem, you think:flashsmil

[boostinhard]

Hey,
no probs! I dont know if I would say it like that, its not gonna be all that easy - but definately possible. As long as you understand that by pushing a motor that dar to the limit, takes a fair amount of money and also limits the use of the vehicle - Ie, 500hp from a CA is going to be very peaky, in other words - no fun on the street. thats why some people (especially with street racing going through the roof lately) are making engines with huge low end torque - cos on the street they "feel" like they have much more power, and go a fair bit quicker. But whack her on the track, dyno or even highway - and your a winner all day long ;)
Sam

[boost_boy]

I mean after 7years of beating my head with these engines, i've concluded that this one is not the torquiest one of the bunch and with the addition of the go fast parts, I don't expect to have this car on the street too much if at all. Money, well let's just say I've spent enough and no expense was spared, except for the stock rods being strengthened. The valve train is completely done up with JUN 272 10.5mm cams, JUN solid lifters and valve springs and the head had to be machined to get the cam lobes to clear their rotation areas. Block has wiseco pistons (standard bore), polished crank and host of new accessories. And I'm using 720cc injectors as well as nice size turbo, sheetmetal intake, custom turbo manifold, 300zxTT pump and all kinds of crap as well my standalone system. I think it will do it. I have the program for it, but I won't know until I put it together and get the ball rolling. I will keep you guys informed of the progress............

Dee

[boostinhard]

Hey,
sounds impressive - no doubt! You need to post some pics up! I will be posting current pics of my engine when this new digi cam arrives (my sis took our old one with her to Europe.... lol)
Sam

[Akela]

Regarding Chris's ET having NA pistons: I kinda can gaurantee that he has NA pistons, as the guy who made his car is the same guy working on my car...ben...the owner is Chris. I even helped rebuild the engine the last time. The pistons are ACL E16 pistons. Also alot of people have told me that fj injectors are 550cc, but that would be at a higher pressure. We flow tested the FJ injectors, i have the result somewhere but they are only about 340cc. I'll try to get the data this evening.

[boostinhard]

hey,
the only reason I doubt that he has NA pistons is because I have great faith in Ben (the engine builder) and simply find it almost impossible for him to have rebuilt the engine, accidently using NA e16 pistons and then forgetting about them till he pulled thehead off again... Plus this picture of his pistons seem to show a rather low compression piston, very similar to that of the e15et piston... I cant say that I've seen a e16 piston before - but I doubt they have the same cancave shape...
Plus I was pretty sure that FJ20 (dont forget they have to be FJ20 turbo injectors not just FJ20 injectors that are around the 340cc mark)
Sam

[drudedon]

boostinhard you just saved me an ass load of money. I was planning on buying a 1.8 from hks for 300 USD. But your telling me you know a place that sells 2mm copper head gasket(which is a must for ca18det) for $110 AUD. HA that's nothing.

[boostinhard]

Hey,
no probs mate! Glad to save you a few bucks! Now you can spend that dosh elsewhere!!! Check out
http://www.ridgecrest.com.au/
for more info, or to contact them. They also make many more custom, high quality parts at very respectable prices.
Sam

[Akela]

Nah man he didn't accidently use NA E16 pistons, apparently the give better compression ratios or something. I got a lecture with him in 2 hours i'll find ou exactly why but he does have na pistons.

[Akela]

Okay heres the info i got for the injectors. Ben tested them himself at 30psi 100% duty cycle and they flowed at 354cc clean, for both fj20det and ca18det of which the early ca18det injectors have the same part number as the fj20. The later ca18det injectors are identical in terms of look and flow apart from o-ring style feed for fuel in stead of rubber hoses.
All ACL pistons are made of the same hi-silicon content aluminum and are heat treated to T6 specification, the only pistons that are different are the ACL race series for Aus and V8 motors only. The non turbo ET pistons not only have cast in oil relief for the oil rings but also have extra valve relief cast in. They are more fulii

[boostinhard]

Hey,
hmmm - fair enough. I thought they were surprised when they pulled the motor down to find NA pistons - that was the impression they gave out.
The injectors have been quoted at 520-540cc on many sites, yes I havent flow tested them myself - but it would match every other part of the super tough FJ series engines... Here's an injecotr comparison completed by sash for teh n12turbo club : http://www.n12turbo.com/mods/injectors.htm
Sam

[boostinhard]

Hey,
found the post where ben seemed surprised that they were NA pistons:
found out something interesting this week too, it would seem that we are actually running with pulsar e15 pistons from the non turbo which would explain the valve reliefs but not expalin how this motor has actually stayed together for this long :)

But after even more research, your right about the NA pistons. They are very similar (ACL ones, not factory ones) except that the leaded turbo pistons have chunkier ring land seals....
Sam

[drudedon]

So I can use toyota supra injectors?

[boostinhard]

Hey,
not sure.... I cant say I know what style of injectoir they are...
Sam

[drudedon]

I thought that site you have posted shows compatable injectors

[boostinhard]

Hey,
yeah - its says that CA, FJ and 4AGZE injectors are compatable - so I guess that means that seeing as you allready have a CA, then E15 injectors are compatable too ;) All depends on if you have the hose tail style injectors or the o-ring style. If you have the o-ring style, they're are heaps of injector upgrade options. The rest of the injectors shown on that page are simply for flow comparison...
Sam

[85EXABOY]

500hp without forged pistons is just asking for trouble.. i remember just a few years back there were only a few people who could achieve 500hp from s14's without major $$$$$ mods.

if you can get it all up and runing then that would be wild but the engine would be the last of your problems, if this is going in a exa i cant really see the exa (without mods) taking 500hp through the chassis and the gearbox would be a huge hassle.

[boost_boy]

500hp without forged pistons is just asking for trouble.. If this is directed towards me, I covered this earlier in this thread. It will be using wiseco slugs and a bunch of other goodies that are capable of supporting such a desired horsepower figure. And the car is not an exa, but a nissan sentra which is built on the same chasis as the exa and will do the job whether it wants to or not!;)

[85EXABOY]

thats one wild looking block..

what exactly is a sentra? ive heard of it so many times but have never actually seen a pic.

[boostinhard]

Hey,
I agree - mint looking block dude. And those pistons are sweet! I run Wiseco pistons in my bike - and they are great quality...
Sam

[boost_boy]

Here's what the car that produced 312.5whp looked like before it's death: This a sunny in most other countries..........

[boost_boy]

Here's what it looked like after crashing into a pole:

[boost_boy]

Here's it's replacement:

[drudedon]

Good luck! Were you hurt in the wreck?

[boost_boy]

Yeah, I was hurt pretty good, but thank god for seat belts. As you can see, my windshield was not cracked!

[85EXABOY]

hey arent they called bluebirds in australia, a friend had a sedan one with a sr20det in it and he crashed it so he transplanted all the runing gear into a wagon for the full sleeper look. For the aldelaide guys his net name is PLAYA.

apparantly the sr20 swap was pretty easy as well and completely engineered.

[boost_boy]

The Sentra is a sunny in Japan and is much lighter than the bluebird. The bluebird you may be referring to that resembles this car is called a "Stanza" here in the U.S. Sentras are cheap cars that are pretty light weighing in at average 2260lbs for the B12 model 1987-1990.

[NismoPlsr]

i believe the Bluebird is what we call the altima

[boost_boy]

The stanza was made before the Altima! In 1993, the Stanza Altima was introduced and in 1994, they dropped the stanza name and called it just "Altima". My CA18DET (with intercooler on top) came out of a Jap Spec stanza or bluebird SSS attessa with AWD/4WS features.

[Packrat]

as far as pistons and the like go, my block was bored 20 thousandths over, with unisia pistons, rods, bearings and a new unisia oil pump. the shit works great! i have a re balanced crank, and a re worked head cuz mine was fubard...anyway the problem with turboing the current motor, is its running 10.5:1 compression the only reason i didnt go higher is because they said id need to get a new fuel manegment system to support 11:1. so i was like..naaaahhh....anyway can someone link me a foreign HKS site? cuz i tried reading the japanese one but my japanese is terrible....i wanna find some more stuff for my motor. aight peace...
:-D

[xStraightEdgeGr]

Cory you're a jooo :-P

[Packrat]

shuddap foo :P

[Packrat]

ok guys here is yet another person from my home town, her name is megan. every body be nice and say hello :)

[xStraightEdgeGr]

It's MeAgan :-P But yeah that's me...

[drudedon]

Ok I got my new 2mm copper head gasket how do you get a good seal. Do I need to get some kind of gasket spray or some shit or do I need to heatup the gasket. Let me know. Thanks!!

[boostinhard]

Hey.
it comes anealed from the factory (heated up to make it soft) but you should buy some copper headgasket spray from any auto shop to spray on it aswell.
Sam

[drudedon]

Thanks!!!!

[SeGGy]

caint wait to getta CA18DET now ... all this talk about it has made me obbsessed with gettin one...i thank u all for makn me detirmed to save my ass off ! :afro: